That's right folks this car blows the fuse for the left low beam only when cranking the engine over. Like what the fudge! Well, let's have a look.
-Enjoy!
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-Enjoy!
If an SMA Video has helped you out please consider giving using "Patreon" to help support us. The videos take real time to create and pull us away from real work that pays our bills. CLICK HERE: https://www.patreon.com/southmainauto
CHECK OUT OUR "SMA SWAG" STORE! Go on Teespring and get your very own SMA merch!
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If you don't like Patreon feel free to use the "PayPal Me" link: https://www.paypal.me/SouthMainAuto
The South Main Auto Amazon Store:
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AES Wave Automotive Diagnostic Tools: https://www.aeswave.com/cart.php?m=affiliate_go&affiliateID=2525b91fc8e906e8215984074c9d9e8f&go=https://www.aeswave.com/Miscellaneous-p9347.html
Thank you for all the continuing support!
--Eric & Vanessa O.
Feel like sending some swag to SMA because you love the videos but don't know where to send it?
Just ship it here:
South Main Auto Repair
47 S. Main St
PO Box 471
Avoca, NY 14809
Disclaimer:
Due to factors beyond the control of South Main Auto Repair, it cannot guarantee against unauthorized modifications of this information, or improper use of this information. South Main Auto Repair assumes no liability for property damage or injury incurred as a result of any of the information contained in this video. South Main Auto Repair recommends safe practices when working with power tools, automotive lifts, lifting tools, jack stands, electrical equipment, blunt instruments, chemicals, lubricants, or any other tools or equipment seen or implied in this video. Due to factors beyond the control of South Main Auto Repair, no information contained in this video shall create any express or implied warranty or guarantee of any particular result. Any injury, damage or loss that may result from improper use of these tools, equipment, or the information contained.
So….when the headlights are off, the headlight circuit would open……yes? Cranking the engine wouldn't matter. But if the headlight circuit is shorted to the starter wire ….somehow…..then when you engage the starter it would shoost high current through the headlight circuit. (as Lisa on Green Acres would say)
As soon as you explained the circuit and how it works I was thinking daytime running lights.
I see a trip to the wreckers coming up …
Do you have a time sert kit for triton motors? I have one that I don’t need anymore and would like to send it to you if you want it. Love the channel by the way, keep up the great work.
Well, Mr. O. A good detective always works better if he gets a clue. Anyway, thanks for sharing! Stay healthy!
In new zealand you can disable DRLs as long as they are not use as park lamps that dim , if one fails you can either fix it or disconnect the other one , if you only have one going it will fail an inspection, after market DRLs can not operate with park lamps or headlamps on
yeah jerk, hold the little bight yellow car hostage for not having crappy headlights on during the damm day
Aveos seemed like a POS to me, like the Nissan Versas (I think that’s what they’re called, the tiny cars).
Very, very interesting case here. Great job diagnosing this weird issue.
The one question that keeps lingering for me is, what happens when the ignition switch is in START that doesn't happen with ignition switch in any other position (if Low Beams are on, but not when they are off), as it relates to the Daytime Running Lights module?
It appears that the load side of the relays, Pin 30, connects directly to the battery and the fuse is in the leg from the Relay Pin 87 to whatever load there is. This seems to be true of all, or most all, the relays. Obviously, the Starter is engaged through the Starter Relay. And, we know that the Starter draws a lot of current. Because the view was of the Meter each time Eric cranked the car, I could not see if the headlights (low beam) dimmed or not, and if so how much. Now I know one test had the left headlight disconnected, so that cut the normal current down in about half, so it would not be the headlights themselves, as this test pretty much proved.
I wish we could have seen the battery voltage when cranking both with and without the Low Beams on. I ask this, again, because there is something that happens when the ignition switch is in START that doesn't happen when it is in any other position, which causes this issue (only if Low Beams are on). Since Pin 30 (load side input) of both the Starter Relay and the DRLs FET (Field Effect Transistor) power input connect directly to the battery (FET through fuses – EF1 in Engine Compartment Fuse Box, and F15 in the I/P Fuse Box), the main thing that does change is the battery voltage will drop when ignition is in START..This is normal, but should not drop to below about 10 volts.
The DRL Module in the I/P Fuse Box might just be bad. Or, something (an input) to this module happens when starting and Low Beams are on into this module. The one thing I can think of is the battery voltage dropping enough to switch the DRL FET on (grounding the LTGRN/BLK wire, which would cause a direct short to the positive side of the battery, IF, the Low Beams are on, across fuse EF21 in the Under Hood Fuse Box, the one that is blowing). This would not happen when Low Beams are off, because relay HDLP LOW RELAY in the Under Hood Fuse Box is not on.
Finally, even if something like I have described (battery voltage dropping, or something else into the DRL Module) is happening, it probably should not cause the DRL FET to drive the LtGRN/BLK wire low if the Low Beams are on. This should never happen under any condition. Since this same module controls turning on the Low Beams and High Beams, as well as Fog lights, through the Headlight Switch & Fog Light Switch, it appears to be working except for the DRL part. I wonder if the Headlights are turned off (or suppose to be, to extend battery life), by this module, when cranking (ignition in START position).
As stated, very interesting. One of the most interesting ones, and extremely well done diagnosis that Eric did. Impressive. And, thanks Eric for taking the time to make this video. It is appreciated very much.
Omegaman
Eric O. showing his libertarian leanings 😁. Just because he lets the customer drive it away doesn't mean he has to give them an inspection sticker.
Great diagnosis on this electrical problem. You are a talented self-made mechanic/technician. I enjoy watching your channel.
Vanessa and Eric, We love you both and we hope Satan isn't attacking you two as Satan hates a married couple that loves Jesus! We do our best to remember you and your lovely godly family in prayer! Please pray for our marriage too!
Had an old neighbor ask for help changing a fuel pump on an early 90s chevy 3500. Said he had a used pump, the pump was in a tank that he said came from a mid 2000s silverado. Told the guy there's no way the pump would go into the old tank. He cut the harness off his truck and wired up the newer pump but left it in the newer tank so it was in no way, shape or form made to fit under this truck properly. The guy stuck an exhaust adapter in the fill hole on the tank to be able to attach the fill hose and wrapped an old rope, like the ones you had to climb In school around the tank and frame several times to secure it. Trust me, there's much more on the roads to worry about than this guys headlights. Needless to say, if I ever seen the guy on the road after that, I went the opposite direction.
DC current flows from negative to positive. Not from the positive source to negative. In a DC Circuit current flowns from positive to negative in the source (Battery/Power Supply). Clear as mud?
This was a great video Eric and I hope you didn't charge this man for the diag, the experience and seeing such an odd failure is worth the time spent.
To me personally I hate day time running light I think it is a waste to have them on cars. What I read online that day time running lights are not required in all 50 states of the US but are required in Canada. The biggest reason I hate day time running lights and think they are a waste because the lights tend to shine right in your eyes when reflected in your rearview mirror or your side mirrors and that can really hurt your eyes and make it hard to see.
Sweden is one of the countries where Day running lights DRL are required by law (since the early 70's)
Well done, Eric. Is this why so many of the GM trucks I see have 1 working headlamp? It's been going on for years.
I've seen a couple of those Aveos with a DRL module that has caught fire. I'm wondering now if it was because someone jammed in a higher amp fuse
Why would they have to turn the lights on and off? They should be automatic.
Half way through I made some popcorn and then enjoyed the resolution. Thanks Eric!
Up here in Canaderp, DRL modules have been required for years; They typically use PWM to get a lower brightness out of the high-beams.
Eric,, Amen brother glad you understand freedom kudos to you.
Eric, thanks for your link to the schematic you and we were looking at. Sort of makes sense this way. Should be noted…"no parts required!". Thanks for Sharing!
"… welcome to the real world kid…". Wish more ppl understood that!
We are supposed to disable the car then hand them the keys.
The life you save may be that customer.
No, you can't hold the car hostage EXCEPT for money owed for repairs. And there may be a $$ amount in your states.
But yes, this is the law in Ohio, not sure about other states but you can Google it quickly.
Now, if you tell them what you did or if the customer puts the coil wire back on or whatever and drives away, thats on them.
If you let them drive it away like nothing's wrong, and the hurt or kill someone, you can be sued and or fined or charged with a minor misdemeanor at the least.
You're not being compassionate by letting them go with real safety risks.
But in Ohio you are not supposed to hand it back running.
((Ohio Title 45, section 4513.02, paragraph (A) No "person" shall drive, move or "knowingly permit" to be driven or moved on any highway any vehicle or combination of vehicles which is in such unsafe condition as to endanger any person ."))
That said, I wouldn't do it for a blown headlight.
But rusty frames to the point its structurally unsafe, brakes, steering suspension, fuel leaks etc.
Absolutely.
Hiya Eric
DRL:reverse current and a transistor. I think my wife’s fit just puts both L and R filaments in series or in parallel for day/night mode.
Damn, I wish I could get my vehicle to you. Maybe you could tell me why my 99 Toyota 4Runner won’t engage the AC compressor clutch at idle, only when the gas pedal is pressed.
It’s driving me nuts.
You’re hot wire going to the starter my be to close to the frame
definiteiy one of best diagnosis you have ever posted.
chinas finest the aveo
Good future reference video Eric.Thanks for the lesson.
put a 15 amp fuse in the low beam!!!!
"Hypothesis 478" 🤣😂🤣 I about died.
yep ….. untill a vehicle leaves a shop and kills the shop owners family / member …. I get what you said … is it extortion if money is not the issue but PUBLIC SAFETY is …. or as I've typed before … let the car go … after calling the police …. who are down the road waiting to do a on the spot roadworthy inspection
I have that same amp clamp. It does not have an auto off function. If you leave it on, it drains the battery. I keep spare batteries in the drawer with it.
Can’t tell you how much I’ve learned about tracing electrical problems from this guy.
To no avail it's still not fixed!!
Not an electronic guy? I come here for your electrical knowledge and have learned alot over the years.
WOW! . . . and you're not an electronics guy! Yeah, right. GREAT JOB!
I know in Washington State that all lights on a vehicle must work or you can get a ticket. That includes lights the vehicle owner installed not just the factory installed ones…
Not a big electronics guy??? if you're not, the rest of us are doomed!
Thanks for the thorough diag! Your channel is the best!
alot of people can turn a wrench, not alot of logical thinkers and electrical diagnostic people out there. eric has a great combination of raw mechanic skills and the right kind of brain for this troubleshooting. great work sir.
Thats some ford world car like the ford fiesta that was made in spain that has daytime running lights also sold also in the states . To cut a corner they used a electronic pulse circuit that had a failure that caused the problem built into the fuse box in the dash, you found it with your service tool using the scope function., good job. You and Ray are some of the top 10 mechanics in the US but you even have your own shop and were smart enough to get the rest of your family evolved like when you had your daughter turn the wheel on the chevy with the ground problem. she will remember that forever. Remember that the kids in the big city are a liability and kids in the rural towns and farms are an asset. The young boys learned as soon are they could push in the clutch on the tractor they had a job with pay and free room and board.
Your closing comments regarding technicians releasing unfit vehicles to the owner (and the road-going public) is a great debate to be had. I'm going to speculate that some of your feedback has been from Ontario Canada, where shops are liable if they release an unfit vehicle. Private shops may turn a blind eye, but franchise garages and franchise dealership garages are putting a lot on the line by allowing an unfit vehicle to leave their bay.
I know of several case where a vehicle owner circumvented the liability matter by calling their CAA (Canadian Auto Association) account and charging a "tow" to their account, thereby retrieving their vehicle from a service garage and also absolving said garage of the potential liability when releasing the vehicle. Games people play.
How else do you move on after the Government has applied the hand-cuffs we all asked for? Tough questions.
Sounds like leaving out that DRL fuse wouldn’t hurt anyone.
In California, drivers are legally required on certain stretches of Highway 99 to run headlights during the day to reduce the number of crashes.
DRL’s are required in Canada or any car imported to Canada and registered.
The design engineer needed the running light module to supply power to both headlights. So logically it would be input at the top of both EF21 and EF22. But when the full headlights are on then that running light power needs to be fuse protected in case something goes wrong in the running light module. So instead of putting a fuse inline with that running light power they snuck running light power to the bottom of EF21 so the line would be protected by EF21. It saves putting in an extra fuse. And both headlights still get running light power but the right headlight goes through EF21 and EF22 in series but that doesn't hurt anything. So if the running light module (or that Lt. green wire) draws excessive current during crank (or at anytime)it will blow EF21.
The motivation for the engineer to do this is to lower the cost of the BOM for the car by one fuse or about ten cents. So for a million cars that saves 100k$. For the engineer working to minimize the BOM, ten cents is something to cheer about. For example for a system that has a BOM of about $10, lowering that to $9.50 would be something worth a great deal of engineering work and would probably get the engineer a raise. Or at least a nice pat on the back as he was being ushered out the door to be replaced by a much lower paid H-1B. (I've been there.)
In Canada all cars made for the Canadian market past a set date require day time lights.
ask scanner danner he will teach you how to use it like he made you
Relay
This is the best murder mystery channel on TV today.
“Not a big electronics guy” huh? Yea I think thousand a of us would disagree with you there bud
As far as the "hold people's car until they fix it" comments, that's crazy. I have seen some death traps. I live in NC. My state has a law that you can't even smoke cigarettes in a car with minors in it, but I worked at a shop and someone brought their car in, with a small child in a car seat. The car stunk of marijuana. A coworker called the cops due to the driver obviously smoking with a child in the car. He was officially instructed to "mind his own business". I have recommended that a car be towed away from the shop, but no matter how bad the car is, sometimes, people just can't afford the repairs. You just have to learn to live and let live, and pay extra for better insurance!
Well done!
So you charge a standard rate for a diag (assuming 1 hr labor). How long did you actually take?
Put the call and the customer's response on the video. That is the best part that you leave out.
This shit is borderline wizardry
Daytime running lights are required when wipers are on during rain.
Eric please move to Michigan , we have salt here to so you'll feel right at home but we'll get your great service AND we'll make you King to boot 😉
whatever happened to the 2 young ladies that used to help u?
I applaud you on your patience. Most machanic’s would just push away the customer and move onto the next job however you took the time to correctly diagnose the problem for that man and learned yet another thing on top of your years of knowledge . Thank you.
I believe in AK, if your on Seward Hwy, you have to have DRLs. And all Trucks gotta have Mud Flaps. Ha. Believe it's a MVD law. I think. Who knows. Love your shop videos… keep them coming.. enjoy them.
All u have to do is note vehicle is not safe to drive. Should not be driven until fixed. What happens after original bill paid not entirely your problem. Problem was already noted.
I loved it that you gave us a wiring diagram to follow along with. Got out my orange marker and went to town. I noticed the wire going from the LH low beam fuse over to the DRL fuse F15 and thought it was odd but I didn't know why. It was brilliant to pull the DRL fuse and the problem went away. Maybe pulling the fuse allowed the DRL module to reboot and it would operate correctly after the fuse was back in.
Not a big electronics guy. Nice one. We do not hold them hostage because we don't want the pos in our parking lot.
Seams like the running light circuit is pushing amps to the circuit along with the ignition circuit. Bad running light relay staying on?
Welcome to the real world kid. Best line ever.
must be a lefty thinking you can seize someones car.
I wish I had half of your pea brain.
I always thought I was the only one who "explained" things to myself before I explained it to others!
At least with trucking, the DOT states that any OEM light, OR any light added to a vehicle, ("chicken lights" on a lot of semi's,) must be working, so I'm not sure, with the wrong cop involved, might be a problem. . . .!!
Daytime lights are required in Canada, on all vehicles. If you come up from the USA and do not have daytime running light, if you get caught, you will get a ticket, or possible car or Tractor Trailer impound
You are awesome man don't let anyone tell you different
Yellow cars don’t need drl’s.
"I'm not a big electronics guy". I've watched you resolder board level components before, STOP LYIN. 😛 I also had a chuckle at the "what's going on? And I say wayayayayaay" song in the background while you're troubleshooting!
Oh crap Eric you have one of them possessed cars that are nightmares are made of until you solve the mystery as you always do, interesting diag that led to the culprit.
Always interesting as to what the problem ends up being.
Sometimes the DRL circuit runs the two bulbs in series which might make the amp clamp read weird if it’s reading the power coming out and going to the other bulb.
Chevrolet… Toilet Surprise!
I knew you could fix it. Good job 👍
Good job Eric. One question. Why, only during cranking, does the day time runner circuit cause the problem?
I haven't seen your solution yet, I just got to high beam crank test and I'm screaming pull the daytime running lamp fuse and test low beam crank. Let's see how wrong I am….. 🤣
Ok, yep, the fuse value the diagram shows for the DTL is 15 amps, but the headlight fuse is 10 amps. Why when the surge to 10.5 amps kills the headlight fuse, but not the daytime. Great job. Way to hang in there! Not everyone would get this. Not by a long shot.
Not sure about the US, but often a mechanic can hold a vehicle where he has done work on it and there is a debt, otherwise known as a lien.
A shop needs to inform the customer of an unroadworthy/dangerous condition just in case the client comes back later claiming ignorance after some incident.
This can be nasty if a third party gets injured.
Good work. I expected a primary ground failure. Keep up the good work!
"Remember viewers, if. I can do it, you can do it."
Proceeds to go God mode in diagnosis…
That was a strange one to diag…. I would still be scratching my head…… Electronics isn’t my thing. I can barely change a fuse or bulb. Heck, changing a bulb on some vehicles means dismantling half the darn vehicle. And now with all this fancy led stuff you can’t just change a bulb, you have to replace the entire assembly….
One of the best SMA videos I've seen. Great work mate!
Here's a reality check .a doctor operates and kills a person. A mechanic does a bad brake job or suspension work . We could injury or god forbid kill alot of people. Mechanic is a very high skilled job . Unfortunately not vey well rewarded for the work we do. But as myself I love cars .cheers 🍺
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Wondering if you have ever used your videos to prove to a customer what the problem is?
Probably way late, but what are those awesome kiwi pliers you pull fuses with? I need them!