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Entering Pain Now now let's just see how deep this Rabbit Hole goes here. 13 volts uh 550 cold cranking amps. Come on there we go. This bad battery.

not a good start. Yeah, see that. Not that. not that, not that we have another.

PT Cruiser Uh, this Cruiser has a history of being dead. Um, somebody worked on it once upon a time. They put a lot of parts in it and they couldn't get it running and they took it apart and I still couldn't get it running and it's still apart. So now I'm gonna try to get it running I don't know what the year is I don't know what the mileage is I'm gonna put it together a little bit and I'll try to crank it first and see what happens I just don't know.

This is a found dead type of a project here. Dude, that's not good. Positive, Negative: Good enough for now. Okay let's see.

Keys Keys which I have two here. two Cruisers words and two sets of keys. So I don't know which one is which 127 399 miles on this PT Cruiser of uh I think it's an O4. Let's check that.

it's just so we know 2 000 and manufacturer didn't win every. I don't know. 2002 that's an O2 All right 2002 PT Cruiser non-turbine let us attempt to starting. the engine.

doesn't crank. Okay, why doesn't it crank? Okay So we've got a fuse panel that's opened up right here. Uh, nothing here says anything about the starter or cranking. Let's check under the hood.

I Found the cover under this fuse box removed. We've got a there's a relay hanging out right here. that's what I found and starter relay. That is that one.

Where's our starter at? Okay, it's got a newish looking starter. someone's replaced this before. Um, let's probe that. Let me let me get a wire lead on that.

We'll see if we're getting power down to the starter earliest to the solenoid from the key. So so far we have a no crank condition. Um, don't know why. So what I'm gonna do here is we're gonna fetch a wire lead.

That guy will do it. We're going to connect this to the terminal where the Exciter wire is for the solenoid. So the power that's sent to the starter from the key to close the solenoid to crank the starter. we're going to probe that wire.

We're gonna see if it's getting power. I Probably should have got a meter or a test light while I was back there, but I didn't man. I'm terrible today I Even forgot to say hello everybody. Good day to you! Welcome back way down yonder, there is a starter.

Uh I Don't know if you guys can see it, but there's a little green wire sticking off of that starter solenoid. That wire is the one that should be supplying power to that solenoid in order to crank this. Beast wait wait wait wait wait never mind. That's not it.

that uh, that green wire supplies power from the cable that supplies power to the starter. That's just a an additional circuit. but what I'm looking for is just below it with a connector. So I'm gonna go in there with this alligator clip and get that connected and then we can check for at least a signal power going to the starter motor.
All right. Listen, so lighting is terrible and I uh well. I don't have any space to work with here so just bear with me while I get this hooked up. Let's see here.

I Can only see it. like with one eye through this little crack right here so you guys can see about as much as what I can see. I'm just trying to get this lead connected and I missed one more shot here. Come on.

Lead, get on there. we need you. Nope, it came off. Third time's a charm.

Yeah, Oh nope. Dragon all right. All right got her. that's connected.

Okay, so the green lead is now connected to the Exciter wire on the starter. So for fun, let's see if it's gonna crank. It's just there's our our positive. Ah, it is capable of cranking.

See that. let's see if it'll start. So the problem is, it doesn't crank. Not with the key.

anyway. Okay, so key on with us starting the engine. Got it. So it doesn't start, Doesn't crank, doesn't start.

Yeah, it's dead. Okay, Okay, here's what we're gonna do. Uh, skew this off so it doesn't kill that junk battery and we are going to consult the service data: Okie Dokes We got her pulled up 2002 Chrysler PT Cruiser They call it a truck that's funny 2.4 liter and we're looking for some diagrams. and I want electrical diagrams and I want the diagram of the cranking circuit.

That's what I want first because if I can't crank it with the key, then we can't get it to start. So let's see here we're looking for. Let's try power and ground distribution. That might work.

Okay, so we have our starter motor assembly right here. Now It's it. gets its ground from the engine block, so there should be no ground on this. That's the ground right there.

There It is the big red wire that is our power supply wire from the battery. There's our battery right there. and from that wire, the other wire runs over here to Fuse one at the power distribution center. I'm assuming that that works, but we should check it anyway when we go back.

But I Do believe fuse Number One is functioning because there is stuff inside the car like the ignition switch that is also functioning. now. from Fuse one, there's another leg that feeds the starter motor relay. so we've got power coming in and that gives power to the relay that is responsible for cranking the starter.

So what we're looking for. We're assuming we have all that, but we do need to check this fuse. Let's go check our fuses first and then we'll check this relay and we can go from there. All right.

We've got a starting and charging diagram printed out here. Let's go see what we can come up with. There are, uh, there's a couple fuses. We've got fuse number one, that's a primary fuse I'm assuming that that works, but you know what they say about assumptions.

So let's check fuse number one. Now these are not numbered, but ignition start 30 amp. Uh, that should be this one right here. and it does look like it's okay.
Uh, I can see the film inside or the element inside and it does not appear to be broken. Uh, let's check that uh bus right there for power. Anyway, Yeah, so here I'll ground the meter. Bring that guy in.

we're gonna set you up for uh. voltage? DC Yes and our lead. Okay, we have voltage on the bus That's good. same thing with the other bus.

Uh, while I'm here I'll just check all these fuses good. So far, the fuses that I'm looking at that have power. Uh, do not. Uh, they're all.

they're not open so that's not the issue. We've also got a starter relay which is this unit right here and we have the infamous Chrysler ASD relay. That's that one right there. Let's play the relay swapping game real quick and just see if uh, if anything comes back to life, we'll swap the ASD that one Powers all kinds of stuff.

We'll swap that one with the uh, the radiator fan relay which is the one I got my mitts on right now. We'll just flip-flop those from one spot to another, get in there and we'll try to crank it. If that ASD relay is dead, then the PCM is dead and we're not doing anything. NADA Okay, so now what I want to do is we're going to pull the starter relay out.

Swap that one more time. We'll do the horn relay and this is still connected to the solenoid so let's just see if it still works. Yeah, so it's capable of working, but the key is not exciting it. Nada.

Now it does not. Escape me that um, all the steering column stuff has been removed at one point I'm not sure what that's about, but that might bring us uh, closer to our problem trying to see if this thing does anything When you all right? So the ignition switch is doing something because it there was a change of state when I keyed it. Okay, we have power in here. No power there.

power there. No power at the door locks. That could be a clue. Okay, okay now what I want to do is go back to the starter relay which is that unit right there.

We're gonna disconnect that and we're gonna test. Is there a pin four? Position four? We're going to test for that intermittent power when I crank the key. So what I'll do is we know we have hot coming in, so we're going to check for 12 volts or one of these pins. there's our 12.

nothing there, nothing there, and nothing on the third one. But we do have 12 volts right here. So let's switch this over to continuity to ground and we'll see which one of these is grounded. Not that one, that one, not that one.

So it should be this one or this one that is supposed to energize when given the uh the signal to crank. So let's see which one of these is actually the pin that runs down to that solenoid. What I'm going to do next is I will connect the negative lead to that lead that's going down to the solenoid. It's hard to do one-handed and we'll check continuity again between those two pins.
Not that one. Oh, not that one either. There's no continuity. It's weird.

Okay, okay, real easy. What I'm gonna do is I'll just set this probe up on that pin right there and then I will crank it if we get voltage at that. PIN and we know that the key is operating as designed or the ignition switch is operating as design. Okay, I've got a lead on the pin I've got our meter set to voltage.

I'm going to crank it and we should see voltage off that pin when cranking. Get that in there. wiper blades see that? So it was trying to. What are we doing here? Okay, so it was trying to close the relay from the key when, uh, when it was commanded to crank.

So let's put that relay back where it goes. Are you guys listening to that? really? Tell me if that thing clicks over? Okay, Do you hear it? No clicking? Okay, so the relay is not closing. That's our issue. So we've got power going to it at this pin from the ignition key.

So when you go to turn the key, it energizes that circuit. And then we should have a power supplied circuit coming from fuse number one. So we do have a power supply right here. We'll verify that is fused by just pulling the fuse and then checking it.

Then we have that wire should be running down to the solenoid. So let's recheck that again. Back to continuity. It's either this one or this one.

Nope, that's that one. So theoretically, if I were to energize this wire right here, it should cause this. uh, this engine to crank. So let's try it.

I've got another lead here. Put this one, put the clip side on battery positive and we'll just test it out real quick. This goes straight down to the solenoid. the green one nose crank when that one is energized.

Now that one, That green one should be connected to this pin right here. So let's energize this one and it cranks. Okay, so what we don't have is something going on with this pin right here. Because we've got power, we've got signal, and we've got our circuit to the solenoid.

We don't have a ground to complete the circuit and that's why this relay is not being allowed to close circuit to the starter solenoid circuit. signal from the key power supply and that's a grounding wire of some sort. and our ground is supposed to go. Look at that powertrain control module.

That's our circuit. From our key, that's our powered circuit. From the fuse, that's our circuit to the starter solenoid circuit. B2 Tan wire going down to relay control.

that's PCM Powertrain control module on the firewall behind power distribution center. That's where the ground is uh, is supposed to be coming from. Interesting. Very interesting.

Okay, we're gonna cheat really bad to prove this out. So this is supposed to be our ground pin. Okay, I'm gonna put this alligator clip on that ground pin and I'm going to reconnect it over here to battery ground. so I've removed it from the solenoid.
I'm going to plug this in and to prove out my theory. this thing shouldn't crank when I hit it with the key. let's go see what it does. I'm not supposed to be doing that, but since I know I have a ground problem, let's see what happens.

All right. And now it cranks with the key. but all we did was artificially Supply that ground and it still isn't starting and we don't have any crank signals. See that I wonder if we have a PCM problem? Well, maybe we do.

Maybe we don't. Um, someone's already put a PCM in this. Thing Once Upon a Time Maybe we just have a PCM ground problem. Oh man.

Okay, okay here's what I'm gonna do. So we've got. uh, we do have this wire right here. um I want to make sure that this wire is in good shape between the relay which is uh, you can't see between the relay and between the connector the PCM So all you really need to do is run a continuity test between that ground pin right here and its matching pin over here in one of these two PCM connectors.

I don't know which one it is. so I'm just going to take them both off, disconnect the battery again while I do this because of ring. No seriously, that you can. you can break stuff.

not doing that. Come off of there please. It's a tight squeeze and I might just unbolt this whole unit. Yeah, we're gonna do that instead.

Let me get this guy to come out. It's it's unclipped. it just won't let go I need some Leverage Let's do uh encourages connector to become unconnected. Why won't it go break It first.

That's it. Come on dude. serious ly bend the pins. Okay, all right.

one more, let's get this guy off. Please thank you. Okay now I just need to figure out which one of these wires is the uh, the other end of this line right here. So what I'm going to do is just reconnect my meter back to uh to that pin.

and I'm just going to probe all the pins until I find the right one. So we connect yellow to Black and we'll plug that in right here. We'll test our meter. Continuity is good.

We just go through and pin all these real fast. Problem s Okay, maybe I wasn't getting a good connection. so let's just flip these leads around. I'll try one more time.

Let's go through. No, no, no Booyah Okay, so we now know that the wire from the PCM going to the starting cranking relay is in good condition. So that leaves us the um. Well that leads me to almost conclude that the the PCM is faulty because we know that the the starter has power going to it.

We know that the key is sending power to the relay. We know the relay has power and we know the relay has connection down to the solenoid. What it doesn't have is ground to or from the PCM. If we artificially Supply a ground it will then work.
But that doesn't mean that the PCM. and that ground circuit does not uh share another function like allowing this thing to run. So um, actually, you know what what I want to do? Let's uh, let's see if it shares that ground with a Uh with the ASD relay because the ASD relay I believe controls many, many functions on this vehicle. So we'll pull.

uh, we'll pull that fan relay back out because it's in the way. We'll fetch the ASD relay because it's right there Now that ground should be the same ground as this one Right here. that is, if those uh, those two circuits actually share a ground and then that's the faulty circuit within the ECM. That makes sense.

So what I'll do will recheck it. We'll recheck our continuity here. And okay, we have ground again. We're at that at the same wire between the ECM and the fuse panel.

Let's check the ASD for uh. ground connection. All right, that's negative. ASD does not share a ground with uh, the with that circuit.

Okay, so this is where it's going to get good. You see, we noticed that the starter relay doesn't work. The ASD relay didn't click over I didn't hear the fuel pump relay come on when we tried to key it on. Now we know the key is operating what we uh.

printer gravity. We're already suspecting that PCM is faulty. So what I'm going to do is we're going to go through all these printouts where we have a power or ground to this PCM and we're gonna go check those at the connectors and uh and make sure that PCM has everything that it needs to function. If the PCM has power and ground everywhere that it should with key on and we're not getting the outputs from the from the PCM then we can conclude that that unit is faulty and will need to be replaced.

Okie Dokes. So uh, I went back outside and I checked for uh, all the powers and grounds going to that PCM and it has everything it's supposed to have. I'm very much suspecting that that unit's faulty. Um, considering that this is a train wreck of a diag because I have no idea what's been done to it, my plan of action here is going to be to just go outside to steal one off another one of those cars and we'll plug it in and if it works then we know for sure.

if it doesn't work then, um, well, I'll drag this thing inside and actually start diagging it. I've got one donor Cruiser over there, there's another one over here somewhere, maybe over there. Uh, that one's turbo so I don't think I can use the PCM in that one and survey says the blue one does not have the same unit. Okay here, let's check the other silver one.

I will coverage parts from everything and that one's different too. Okay, dead in the water? Need to order a PCM That's the problem. I Was hoping I could prove it with a swap or a part swap, but that's not gonna work. Let me check the red one.

Hang on. Just let me check it. I Think there's a issue with the year? It's not the key, Is it? No, it's not. I don't have keys to the red one? Okay, never mind.
Yeah. So basically where we're at, the ECM has all of its powers. It has all of its grounds. However, it is not actuating any of the relay circuits uh, that control the systems in the car.

So this is our issue. This is where we stop. Um I Swear he told me somebody had put one of these in there. at one point this thing's been disconnected, but it also does not look like it's been, uh, been replaced.

So I don't you never really know? Then you know the guy could have told him he'd put one in it and then never actually did it all right. Well anyway, that's gonna. that's gonna call it quit for me for the day. Uh, sorry for the break and uh, what was happening.

my battery died but anyway, yeah, I'm gonna go ahead and close this one outfits I don't know what that was but I probably need it. uh I do know what that was and I don't need it right now. Uh yeah. yeah.

So anyway I'm gonna go and close this one out. Um, it's always like to thank you guys for watching this video. Hope you enjoyed this video! I Know It was kind of short but uh, it is a junkyard Diagnostics today so uh, we figured out we need another computer at the very least and then maybe once we can make this thing crank on its own without adding wires to the system. Uh, the rest of the units will come back online and then this thing should start run and operate as designed so we'll see if we're gonna replace this or not and then we will go from there.

So again, as always, thank you for watching and most importantly, don't forget to have yourselves a great day into! PT Cruiser.

96 thoughts on “It s dead! parking lot diagnosis”
  1. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars HouseCallAutoRepair says:

    Am I the only one that thinks that engine is toast? Cadence?

  2. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars CoolKids says:

    You might as well open a PT cruiser repair shop at this point

  3. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Ian Mcleod says:

    After the first two Cruisers with radiator and condenser problems I think to find the ground, all the wheels should come off first. To bad your can't order those Cruisers to explode into parts on command. Glad I didn't buy one of those back in the day worse than Subaru!

  4. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Ian Mcleod says:

    I've witnessed you repair two PT Cruisers, those two owners have told all their fellow PT Cruiser Club friends that your a magician with PT Cruisers. Welcome to your new life. Raymond the PT dude!

  5. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Robert Swartzwelder says:

    Did you check the neutral safety switch? I didn't see it on your diagram so perhaps the PCM does not turn that ground on unless it is satisfied with the state of the neutral safety switch. Although that car is old and I'd think it would be in series with the crank signal from the ignition switch? I avoid Chrysler so I don't know. Great video! Thanks for bringing us along!

  6. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Gamin says:

    cant run with no GAS??

  7. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars rob8742 says:

    When will people learn some cars just aren't worth the money to fix them

  8. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Erik Hilsinger says:

    Bad capacitors from the early 2000s? my 2004 Ford excursion had bad caps and the junkyard replacement from the same year had defective caps. Had to send it out to a shop that could remove the potting epoxy, replace the exploded parts, and regoop it. Fun.

  9. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Casmige says:

    Park/Neutral safety switch.
    Brake/shifter interlock switch.
    Immobilizer module (antitheft)

    Before you do all that other fancy testing & everything you always check for spark you always check for a fuel & you spray a little carb cleaner into the already open throttle-body to see (while you jump start it with the test lead), if it starts & runs.

  10. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars u h says:

    Check for a SKIM key mismatch error which would be the chip is not being detected or the PCM was replaced and the chip was not programmed. Get a DRB III to program. Oh and the no start condition may be a broken timing belt but the good thing is that it’s a non-interference engine.

    Also, 01-03 non-turbo pcms are interchangeable but the VIN code needs to be configured in the PCM for it to work. During the onboarding process the SKIM module is also configured to the PCM. I have instructions for programming the new PCM using a DRB III if ya need it.

  11. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Al Niemann says:

    It's been my experience that you only need two tools to fix a 20+ yr old PT loser;
    A gallon of gasoline and a match 👍

  12. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars rks23 says:

    High pitched sound …

  13. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars julio says:

    The famous PT cruiser round three fight 😂😂

  14. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Daniel Gomez says:

    Question! Do Throttle spacers work??? Adding horsepower or torque??

  15. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Chris J says:

    How come you didn't check power and grounds for the pcm

  16. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars paul .a larner says:

    looks like imobiliser issue to me!

  17. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars franco deiuliis says:

    You must want to puke when a pt cruiser shows up lol
    Cheers from Nova Scotia

  18. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Hugh Jass says:

    It ain't got no gas in it

  19. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Ross Bowman says:

    If that PCM was replaced it might not be programed. Check to see if it was with your scanner. Good luck Ray.

  20. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Mark Emerson says:

    A thermite grenade would solve most of the problems I had when I owned a PT Cruiser. I spent a few thousand bucks on repairs before I figured that out.

  21. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Dropdoc says:

    Is that a chipped key with theft deterrent? With the column disassembled It may be worth checking to see if that system was disconnected or a neutral safety switch is bad.

  22. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars James Landess says:

    I know I know this is completely off topic and answered already but what kind of rear view cam do you have in the Silverado Ray

  23. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars davidbwa says:

    How did you end up with so many PT Cruisers? Was a tow yard auction having a bulk sale?

  24. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Blade says:

    Ray you need yourself tablet or a laptop that you can pull up the warring diagrams on, and have it with you and situations like that.

  25. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars russell crawford says:

    Neighbor had a ram truck that kept leaving him stranded. Had it towed many times to the dealer only to start. Could not duplicate the problem. Finally they duplicated it. The key wasn't being recognized and wouldn't allow cranking. Not familiar with pt cruiser but perhaps has similar technology. I'd definitely look into it prior to condemning the computer

  26. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Michael Allen says:

    I have the same model and year PT Cruiser. What I have learned is the SKIM must first recognize the key and then sends a ground command to the PCM, and then the PCM must send the ground to the relay. If the PCM was changed and not matched to the SKIM/key, the PCM may not be the problem, only the SKIM/key are not matched to each other and then the PCM doesn't recognize the signal. Been there and done that.

  27. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars m35a2ww says:

    Neutral safety switch? Brake switch?

  28. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Lee Trent says:

    I would check the T C M however service writers diagnose from their desk.

  29. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Thunder Beast says:

    Graveyard of PT Cruisers lol

  30. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars N6DL says:


  31. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars MR HEART says:

    Just a question. If the PCM is faulty. If you turned it on and attached the scan tool. It would not be able to communicate.

  32. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Scott Philippi says:

    What is with it with PT cruisers in Florida? They are like cockroaches.

  33. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Blitz6804 says:

    "Lighting is terrible and there's no space to work in" So… it's a PT Cruiser?

  34. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars wolfguardian says:

    I gott a fix…Gallon 'a gas 'n a Road Flare…..

  35. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars crp gap says:

    What planet are we on? How can soooo many PT Cruisers exist in one place? And should they?

  36. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Diana B says:

    Florida, land of the PT Cruisers. 😁

  37. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Greg Rice says:

    Personally I would check if the key(s) are programmed to the vehicle before yanking the pcm unless you've already ruled that out. Granted these pcms on anything chrysler older than 2011 are junk.

  38. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Jose Miranda says:

    You got the anti theft activated that is the red light on the left gauge…

  39. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Jon Thurgood says:

    Ray, there's a very high pitched sound whenever your camera was near the PCM. I could hear it change when cranking so it was definitely coming from the car. Sound went away when battery was disconnected.

  40. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars 1045120967384668 says:

    The fuel Guage did show empty. Maybe it has no fuel. Just thought i'd point that out

    + the anti theft i'm betting they have not had the key re-coded to match the anti-theft from the replaced PCM the door buttons not working happened when i changed my broken 1 with 1 from the wreckers and didn't get the key recoded.

    Long story short the key needed re-programming with one of those key programming devices that most locksmith's have or mobile road side assistance have in there aresonal of tools.

  41. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars August Inter-nation (Augy) says:

    Darn Ray….when it comes to cars / trucks, is there anything you don’t know????
    You are so young to know so much!!!!

  42. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Seth Sternin says:

    you have patience ray

  43. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars evilborg says:

    brake or parking switch??

  44. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars Jim C says:

    With other people said I think it's the security system stopping it from cranking. Could be key not programed into system happens alot when batteries get disconnected frequently which would shut all systems off also those older Chrysler car if you put a computer programed it could trigger all computers to look for the security. Other car ok for test parts Chrysler you can get a bunch of headaches if not do right

  45. Avataaar/Circle Created with python_avatars robert cummins says:

    Ray your content is lacking as is your location. You should go ask for your old job back,Or you could continue as you are with people on you tube praising you for being a big headed c@nt. Your current location looks cheap. I think you are living for you tube maybe take a step back.