Doing a simple front brake job on a 2019 Subaru Forester using OEM parts. Napa screwed me out of the parts I ordered from them but that's ok. I like the OEM stuff 😁
-Enjoy!
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If an SMA Video has helped you out please consider giving using "Patreon" to help support us. The videos take real time to create and pull us away from real work that pays our bills. CLICK HERE: https://www.patreon.com/southmainauto
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Thank you for all the continuing support!
--Eric & Vanessa O.
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Disclaimer:
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Uh, we got the 2019. It's the Subaru the Forester the big two five. We need to give it a brake inspection. Put that back on for the fella. Uh, 70 some thousand miles on this little guy I guess and he's not happy with the braking effort or the amount of effort applied versus the amount of breaking gained I guess I Took it for a drive. It does have a bit of a spongy pedal, nothing crazy. if you climb on, the brakes heavy, they do have a bit of a shimmy. Apparently his cars never had front brakes and it's had one set of rear, so we're gonna pick it up, have a look at it, see what it needs for brakes, and see if we can get some stuff today. At least that's part of the plan anyhow. foreign quarter pad left or still I Want to pull the wheels to have a little gander and evidently these aren't super old in the back said that we did them, so they got to be good. right? Foreign 10 left. Let me grab a screwdriver here. Okay, that's really not too bad for him. Seventy some thousand stuck in the bracket. a little bit here. not completely wasted, but getting down there pretty good. Like I said, the effort was a little bit high for the amount of stopping power you had. Well, yeah, you might have had another. You know, five or ten thousand miles left in. Those pads seem to be worn, pretty, even a bit of a rust Ridge there pins are seized up. Let's pop off the other side. Yeah, about the same thing on this side. not completely spent, but just getting down there. pretty good. It really wasn't too terribly stuck, but you can see that there about the same sweet, plenty of pad here on the rear. It's kind of. look into the caliper here. it's a little better than 50 percent. Anyhow, probably closer to 65 or so pad left there. I'm just gonna have a look at the inside rotors. make sure they're you know, nice and clean like the outside here. About the look: I think he said it was about a year ago we did those. It definitely looks, uh, like some even wear these this style pad and Racket on these Subarus they are similar to The like older Chryslers No, you know, no brake hardware or anything. They don't have a tendency to seize up in the bracket, so it's a pretty good brake design for the Rust Belt Well, that was easy. Called the fella let them know where he's at with everything he said. just do it. It's if it's close, do it for less than half. Do them. Okay, so before we push the Pistons in, gonna go in with the Weezy wheel cleaning up your tool if you guys remember that. I Just like to use that to knock off some of the big chunks of rust before we go in with just your standard you know, 36 grit cookie wheel. I Get some of the big chunks off when we get in here flat. Before we push them in. that looks pretty good face. I Always look inside the caliper. you know where the pad sits. make sure there's not a lot of rust and junk on that. This one's not too bad. So now that we have you know the big chunks cleaned off, it's a lot easier to do before you push the Pistons in. We're going to take and push them in foreign. You can use a couple of you know, channel locks or two pairs of C-clamp vice grips or a little caliper pushy tool. There's a little bit of air in the boots. sometimes you can just pick them up with your fingers here on the edge, but these ones are holding the air so we'll just come in it or come at it with a bent screwdriver. Keep it pointed towards your piston. We're going to work it right under that lip of the boot where it hooks onto the piston and kind of push it back. You can see it get down in the crack and what I call burp the baby. Just pick it up and let the air out. Of course that one did not work. See if I can find that lip again underneath it. Pick it up. There it goes and then you'll see the the boot suck in. You don't have to but the chance of pinching your boot in. the pad increases. If you leave it like this. let me show you see how see how this boot you know folds back on itself like that and this one's still puffy. If you put it on your caliper bracket and you accidentally you know Bend the boot over and it gets pinched between the caliper and the pad and you don't see it, you know. Let's say it goes like that. as that piston comes out, it'll it'll rip the boot. So like I said I just come at it like this. kind of push it back. You'll see where the the boot hooks onto the Piston here, just wiggle down in that Groove Pick it up a little bit and you'll You'll see it suck right in there and then you can just let it down so that's that. that's all prepped. You can see where the rust on the rotor was hitting the caliper here. got a few shiny spots so now I'll just come in here with a stiff wire brush, knock some of the big junk off, hit it with a blow nozzle and that'll be it. You'll get about one in the Northeast You'll get about one brake job of a set of calipers. All right Subaru Because what will happen is these Pistons will Rust through and then they'll certainly can break fluid. They're pretty thick I mean as you can see, but you can see the amount of really heavy scale that builds up inside of them. So Eventually these actually rust straight through. There we go. I Think that'll be good? I'm gonna grab a 19 swiveler. We'll pop the bracket off, grab a leash because it's time to bring out the dog. Bring out this nasty hasn't made an appearance in a while. Show you how the dog does it. A little bit of an Overkill but hey, there's that. So we'll take the rotor off. It won't take it. peel the hardware off. I'm gonna go stick it in the sandblaster like we always do. We're going to clean out where the pad ears sit and where the hardware sits. Get rid of that rust and junk. Then we'll come back. We'll check our pins, make sure they're lubed up. Be ready to roll. these are 3M Stud cleaner, not a stud cleaner. It goes around. the stud allows us to clean in that portion of the Hub or at least some of it anyways. Wish someone would start making these of various diameters because it works on some, but not all. It always fits around a stud even up to I. Don't know what are these 14 millimeters or 12 millimeter? you can go up to 14s with that looks like maybe a 14 millimeter hole. but I Wish the outside diameter of the disc was bigger, but more often than not it doesn't come all the way. you know to the bottom of the Hub or the inside. Foreign some cars where this is quite Rusty In here, it could be a pain to get the rust out. A typical wire brush usually doesn't do anything to rust other than just polish it. In this case, it's taking us down to Bare Metal because this is just a little bit of surface rust because the car is only a few years old for a few years in. New York is like a lot of years in other places. All right. So I think everything's prepped and ready on this side. We just gotta wait for parts now. Well, waiting for Napa we'll pull these out and have a look. The grease item still looks really good. I Can't really justify adding anymore. I Just like chucking them anyways, you have to be really careful adding grease to the ones that have the rubber guide pin on them because it'll act like a little hydraulic cylinder. This will actually seal really well if you got a lot of grease on the back side and as it heats up, it pushes that out like a hydraulic cylinder. I've actually seen it on a few instances where it'll fry the front outer brake pad right. clean off the car. so be cautious if you're adding. you know, a ton of silicone grease to the pins if they're nice and lubed and you know no real reason to add any more, don't Good news and bad news folks. the Good news is we have brake parts here. The bad news is Napa screwed us again on our parts so we had to pull out an emergency. had to send Mrs Owen a little over an hour drive each way to the Subaru dealer to pick up some OEM Parts because hey, we're Ding Dongs We tore the vehicle apart because we trusted that Napa was actually bringing us our parts but they dropped the ball. Big Time A guy had a whole bunch of excuses. Whatever. I do like the OEM Parts on these. However, I quoted the fella on aftermarket. You know the I was going to use the Napa CR the coated rotors and the Adaptive One pads. so they're top shelf breaks. So the other bad news is I'm not making a dime on the brake job because I have to honor my price to them. It's not the customer's fault the Nampa screwed up. It's my fault for taking the car apart before I had to stuff in hand is what it is. so we're putting now with the factory brakes. If you're buying. oh you have brakes for it. You have to buy the pads and a shim kit. So don't forget to buy the shim kit. and it does come with a Molly coat grease that they they send with it. it looks like never sees. It's a gold colored Grease foreign of the shim here. I'm just using our ceramic Lube that we use on everything else. The silhouette CRC I See, it's a rubber coated shim anyways. so there's that. There's all the shims. Let's get our brackets. We'll get our brackets moved up. We'll put our new hardware on those. of course. Seeds have already been sandblasted I Think we already discussed that and we're a little under the gun because this fell is supposed to be here. Not too long of a Time to pick the car up because I Thought we had plenty of time. It's kind of like reality TV except if we don't get it done, we don't lose everything. It's like they do in reality. TV You know, because their entire business plan is always hinging off the profit of one vehicle, right? All the shims are the same, so we'll stick these in any old place. Okay, the wear indicator does need to go towards the bottom, on the lower side or on the Leading Edge I Guess it would be. Let's see. So that goes. This bracket goes like this. so we want this one here. We'll be on our outside. Stick that in too, because that's also like an anti-rattle hold spring tension out on it. It's gonna be a little bit of a piss pot to get in there. Come on baby. Get her lined up ever so nicely. It does have some tension on it because the wear indicator is also a spring that pushes out towards the abutment hardware. Make sure it's click down all the way. Same thing here. Oops, you gotta get there I guess so you just gotta be careful pushing. You don't want to push it too far, but they should move freely. You can kind of hear us squawking on that spring, but they do move nice and free. So the wear indicator like I say has quite a bit of outward tension on it, so that's what you hear. kind of creaking back and forth there. Foreign folks slap that baby back on, give that a little blast of fluid film. kind of keep it from getting so rusted. Yeah! I Don't think it's gonna work. Stick an axle nut on here and take up some space just to hold that for us. Take our loaded assembly here. Slip that baby right on there. hit the bolts starting yet. Oh some days I Hate Napa Let's see I Hate Napa Song We sing it. Some days it's a lot of paint we have I'll snug this baby up to the correct Fdlbs's We're going to let our caliper down here. We'll put a little bit of Bluebonnet and slip that baby on so we want to a little rust off of there. We're going to lube any metal to metal contacts. That's gonna help alleviate any squealing. So where the caliper here meets the pads? We put a little grease on it and then we'll put a little bit of caliper grease on the Piston faces here. Or you can just Lube the back side of the pad. Either way, Foreign like I Say these Pistons are going to rust out anyways by the next brake job. So we'll go like this. slip it over there, we'll find our bolts and get them in there. Beautiful. foreign. Going for a rep we're going to take put the wheels back on obviously before we go drive it. Step two: we'll pump up the brakes. We don't go slinging out into the street, check our brake fluid, make sure it's full. Kind of curious. You know, looking in service data, it's down in the comments. Every time you do a brake job, everybody chimes in saying oh, you should open the bleeder. You should, you know, close the bleeder, you should empty out the reservoirs plus brakes. You should go jump off a bridge. you know. They give me all the advice they can and I always look in service data just to kind of go along with them to see what service data says. and it's not too often you run across in service data where they tell you to open the bleeder before you push the Pistons back in like rarely do you find it at service data and same thing with Subaru Subaru. Service data was very big. Uh, they don't even tell you to push the Pistons in, remove the caliper body, replace the pads, put the caliper body, back on. Here's your torque specs. Have a nice day, All right. Foreign. Here we go. foreign sometimes. I Guess you don't realize how different the pedal feel is with old brakes versus new brakes. Even brakes like this that aren't even set in this pedal's quite sensitive. Thank you, thank you. That's it folks. Front brakes on your Forester Of course that's using the OEM stuff. not really much different than using you know, your aftermarket. so pretty much the same process you just have to remember when you call to get them from the Subaru make sure you get all the all the different parts. the shims butman Hardware all that stuff. and uh, Subaru ordering their OEM Parts can be kind of tricky because when when you order the rear brakes for these from Subaru they come with the shim kit, but when you order the front, they don't I Don't know, it's just kind of one of those weird things you keep in your noodle because you've gotten boned by Subaru just like you got boned by Napa You just get ahead of yourself and you order stuff and you think it's going to be right and then whatever. Dude, Um, that's it. The whole job went pretty smooth, turned out good. The brake effort is now minimal for the amount of stopping power output by the Subaru so that's how about you guys out put some comments into that comment section insty: Facebook You guys know where to find us while you're down there. Subscribe: Make sure you ring the bell I Don't have to keep telling you but I Do just my reviewers. If I can do it, you can do it. Thanks for watching.
your clear and wonderful film almost makes me think… 'I could do that'… thanks South Main Auto team.
Car is probably rot after 2 years..
Eric why don't you ever wear a face mask when you grind and blow out breaks ? You can see the amount of crap that comes off and is floating about in the video. It would be nice to have you and videos around for a while🙂 Regards Richard 🇬🇧
I do a lot of work on my own vehicles and sometimes the odd friends.
When I'm doing brakes I usually just unscrew the reservoir cap to release pressure which makes pushing pistons back that wee bit easier.
Brakes don't need bled unless you let air into the system or you're doing a fluid change.
Another great video bud.
Thanks Eric
We're going to lose the shop!
Sounded like you were going to output some poop &/or laughter at the end Eric! 😂
Very good
Excellent brake job video. I always learn a little sump'n-sump'n. Can't get enough.
AAAAAAND… thats why napper isnt a sponsor
I always use the brake fluid level as an indicator of how my brakes are.
When I have new pads my fluid is full when it gets lower then it’s time to take the wheels of and inspect the pads etc.
part of my weekly checks along with oil level, coolant level, and top off the screen wash I check the brake fluid level as well.
I always found You shouldn’t need to top up your brake fluid between changes unless there’s a leak in the system and then you need to fix the leak and go through the whole system…
but that’s just me
Now Eric has my 2 cents worth as well lol
Honest Man with INTEGRITY! TOUGH TO FIND NOWADAYS! THANK YOU SIR!
I usually feel when brakes are close to hitting brake wear indicator, like I loose confidence, no clue, what exactly it feels as I call mechanic to take a look and swap the pads and/or discs. Driving the same car every day teaches how the car behaves when healthy, any changes rises eyebrow. I drive an old Dieselgate Passat, a small practical car, trucks with open beds are not common here.
Happy day when you work for free , bless your heart. I want a repair guy like you !!
Hopefully, thumbs up and more comments cover for the loss on this job, Eric. 🙂 Awesome expert job as always!
You sure are whining a lot in this video. Not used to all the crying.
You'll never get that Napa sponsorship now Eric 😉
Hay..love the content..Mr..O..shot out from south texas.san antonio. May. you an your family have a blessed Thanksgiving. 🙏☝️👍👊
Generally speaking, for most applications OEM brake parts are overrated. Top-shelf aftermarket parts are as good or better in most cases. I cringe when I see non-coated rotors installed here in the rust belt. Most manufacturers have installed coated rotors at the factory for a few years.
Whats the music you play on the test drive? Love your show!! I learned a few things when doing my own breaks.
Eric O, where’d your snow go? Love to watch your brake jobs much, much more than I care to do brake jobs
If the parts people at the dealership do their job they would know all the parts you need for a brake job and would suggest the additional parts or supplies you might need (including brake cleaner). It often means more sales and makes some very happy customers especially when their transportation to the store is the vehicle they are going to work on.
you obv have your own disc/drum cutter/lathe, that disc had a nice grind to it @;-D
Love how you give those calipers a little turn before you pull them off to open the piston up just enough to release. It's really nice to see and learn so much from this channel.
Torque wrench for the lugs! What a pro!
I've just made it a practice to loosen the bleeder when compressing calipers just so that I don't push any gunk into the ABS module or other brake parts. Might be different in the rust belt since bleeders are likely seized.
My 08 Tacoma has 170k and original brakes. You think I’m ready for a set of new ones yet? 😂 imma be honest they really haven’t even started squealing yet
Just replaced the rear calipers on my 2013 Outback last week because the guide pins were seized solid. I couldn't believe how rusty the pistons were!
Did my father in law’s brakes this past summer. He was metal to metal. I didn’t think nothing of it. I closed the piston did the passenger side, went to the drivers side, closed the piston and brake fluid was pouring down. Because he kept topping off the fluids it was over full. I worried that I might have damaged something. Luckily I didn’t, or it doesn’t seem so anyway
I didn't expect you to replace the rotors. I thought that they looked good except for the rust around the edge and next to the hub. Good video.
Can you shoot rustoleum on brake parts like that to buy some life span for them?
NAPA!!! 😠😡😮
The only brake system that bleeds out are air brakes.
I was just thinking "Man…I could really go for a SMA break job". Mr. O is a car whisperer and a mind reader!
Most people are morons. What do you think happens when you release the brake pedal after using your brakes. The fluids back to the reservoir. Duh.
Awesome
Mr O why don't you use a dust mask when doing brakes ?
But, but, but, on this car did you say the pedal was a bit spongy? That would indicate that a bleeding might be a good idea. Maybe not for a routine brake job.
Did I miss something… Where did nana drop the ball?
Maybe a dumb question, but if the pads don't freely move what forces them AWAY from the rotor when you stop braking?
The piston isn't moving back right? It takes a ton of effort to compress it during a break change.
And there's no spring/clip on the pads to move them away from the rotor when the piston isn't exerting force. So is it just the razor thin amount of brake pad that gets ground off with each stop and the gap it leaves that the rotor has to move within until next braking?
That sucks you had to eat the cost difference but hey think of it like this, at least you can say your conscious is clean knowing you did the right thing. Does your Napa cover the cost difference for you? I have seen some Napas that are private owned that do when they know it is their fault.
Wheres all the snow ?
NAPA….NOT A SPONSOR!
See — I've seen you do how many brake jobs now? And yet, I still learned something new. Shim kit? What the hell is a shim kit? I wouldn't have known it even existed, yet now I know that, if my Mom ever asks me to do a brake job on her Forester, I need to order one. Thanks! 🙂
Great job Eric. Upstate NY is so beautiful compared to NYC. Cheers.
Missed the brake cleaner intro?
Yep service data on the majority state to retract or compress the piston. Just make sure someone hasn't serviced the m/cyl reservoir with worn pads. Great job & you stand behind your quotes which we have to do sometimes.
Hey Eric, you’ve probably never heard this but one of the reasons why brakes lose their feel ( require more effort ) is because of what is called a “thermal barrier”.
In the process of curing and bonding the lining to the shoe certain components within the mix are designed to settle close to the shoe area. Creating a ““ thermal barrier. This thermal barrier is there on purpose to protect the caliper and pistons from the heat of the breaking process. This portion of the lining has a slightly less abrasive content than the rest of the lining. That combined with the rotor surface becoming polished results in less braking feel.
I got this information from an engineer at Delco Moraine, Dayton, Ohio. My former employer.
Bet if you called him and told him they are now OEM (the only way I go on brakes) and that you're willing eat the added costs, but would he mind splitting the added cost, he'd go for it. He knows you're an honest guy and he sounded like he was up for whatever repair is needed.
I never knew about the air pockets in the caliper pistons. LOL, I always learn something here on South Main. Keep up the great videos!
Another excellent break job
one golden tip for you . wear a mask when doing brake jobs . the brake dust will destroy your lungs .
one day you gonna notest you dont get air enought in your system and thats a very scary moment .
DO NOT SMOKE when doing brake jobs people .
Big nasty needs its theme music 😂
Dear SMA, I've seen a few of your videos and there are two things that make me cringe as a retired tech: First, you go to all that trouble cleaning the rust off the hub (that's great) and then you go and use Fluid Film (?!?) on the hub which won't last long and has a very low flash point of 400 degrees. Use a proper anti-seize on the hub which won't be gone in a month and can handle 1200-1600 degrees. Fluid Film is the worst thing you can use for protection on a brake hub. Second, you use a lot of air tools, so wear some hearing protection! Lost hearing and ringing will make you sad when you're older. Otherwise, good work!
Can you please move to Massachusetts. The indy repair shops seem to have all hacks and are nowhere as through or skilled as you. Also, the hacks here would simply not eat the cost if the parts did not show up and they had to go to the dealer..Oh yeah the dealerships are equally as bad..please move to central Massachusetts..👍🙏
Just did the pads and rotors on my kid's 2018 Crosstrek. Man, do those pads sit in the caliper tight! Not a fan of the Subaru anti-rattle set up.
Still love the drive around town to bed the pads.
Are the phenolic caliper pistons better for the rust belt? We see them on some of the reman units. How does the synthetic lube with ceramic differ from the plain synthetic brake lube. Always a trick to be learned watching you. Subaru recommends replacing the brake fluid at 30k intervals. We were told it flushed the water out of the lines and prevented rust in the calipers and cylinders. We live in a swamp so brake fluid contamination by humidity is a given. It's really cloudy after 3 years here. Good vid thanks.
What percentage of new verses returning viewers do you get?
My returning viewer percentage is unfortunately very low!
NAPA, (thankfully) not a sponsor.
My astro 1128 broke last week 1 month out of warranty.i loved that thing.used it every day on the job.i hate when a favorite tool breaks.
How much force is too much when pushing pistons back? At what point will calipers start hanging up and wearing the pads?
As far as the replace the fluid and bleed the brakes thing goes. I at the very least just replace what's in the res after pushing in the pistons on the calipers. It's quick easy and cheap. Brake fluid absorbs water, reducing performance and extreme cases cause corrosion. I guess in the PRNY the car will rust out before it's much of a problem, I've seen cars go decades without a brake fluid change with no apparent problems but it's still a best practice IMO.
I've never seen a caliper piston rust through!
Having rear brakes wear out before the front is kinda strange in my opinion.
I try to check that my pin is well lubed every day. It's THAT important.
good job boss
Weird how the back was replaced before the front…
Eric, what swivels do you use for your air tools? I’ve tried a couple from the Amazon and they always leak air after a few uses. Thanks!
"Not a sponsor"
A big Shout Out to Mrs O for doing that 2 hour trip to pick up the Subaru parts for you and therefore for the customer. I love your videos. They are no nonsense. Good old common sense without any added drama or effects. It is sad though in a lot of ways that for the younger ones coming through (and not just in automotive industry but all industries) The younger ones may think that the older generation are a bunch of old foogies but, The amount of knowledge is extreme. For the younger generation unless you are wise to harness that knowledge which I am sure if you show interest they will teach you. You are going to miss out on so much… Because one day all these older ones wont be around and then you will go "If only I had taken the time to ask or find out" Keep safe and well everyone 🙂
the driver must use the brakes hard. WOW! MY 2017 Forester has 101,000 and the brakes are good.
What is your opinion of torque rods for lug nuts…?
Been very quiet about deer hunting lately last time you said anything was when you were eating some back straps that Mrs O provided. Can we then assume you have been skunked so far…
Subarus are awesome!
Can't help but wonder if someone out there cuts their brake lines before pressing the pistons back in. 🤔
If I was the customer and I saw this there'd be a little special Xmas present finding its way to the shop as a thank you to Eric and Mrs. O.
Call me crazy, but I think that if the quote was for NAPA parts (that were unavailable), and you had to wind up using OEM parts, simply notifying the customer of the difference in price should be acceptable. No one wants to get ripped off, but this brake job simply wasn't that. It's not a bait and switch or upsell. It's parts availability. Character and integrity are not lost. The job was done, and done right. The man should get paid. He's got a business and a family.
Nice brake job…there is a difference between a pro job and a pad slap bad job…quality at its best.
Why did you stop using the permatex extreme blue. I saw you use that so much and recommend it during you older break job videos. Just curious is all as I used it per your recommendations a few years ago one some break jobs. Never had or heard of any issues.
Anyone that says open a bleeder when you push in Pistons is a complete tool.
I learned absolutely nothing but you're still more interesting to watch than these stupid TV shows. By the way I drive a No Rust 2001 Subaru Forester.
Eric, we want you in this channel forever, Don't breathe that rust dust!, PLEASE WEAR A MASK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Bam.
The customer should b given the opportunity to pay. I would. A workman is worthy of his hire. And I am sure he would
Rainman Ray was talking about the non-need to open the bleeder when you push the pistons back in. He said there were only a few cars that had systems that had some sort of anti-backflow valve that you could damage by jamming the pistons back in without opening the bleeder. I think he mentioned some old BMWs. Other than that, he pointed out that the brake fluid is "homogeneous" and you don't have worn-out brake fluid inside the calipers that must be replaced. (My observation: That's why the brake fluid way up in the reservoir gets old and dark)
Good to see a shop using a torque wrench on the wheel nuts. So many places say "We have a calibrated air wrench"
WOW! I want a supercharger for our lifts at work! Stay safe and thank you for sharing.
Napa did not know how
Even the dealers don't use OEM parts when they do brake jobs.
Only 2K away from 750K… very impressive!
Yo that's a bad air hammer 😂 big nasty for the win sheesh , but it look like u gotta hold that horse 🤣🤣🤣💪🏿💂🏿♂️💯
Thanks for another informative and entertaining video!
I've watched a ton of brake jobs you've performed and I've taken a lot of your best practices. I don't live in the rust belt, but I've adopted many of your habits. I was recently complimented on my attention to detail on my process and told I was giving a "premium" effort. I say that to say….people notice when you care about the end result. Attention to detail matters. As the epitome of the shade tree mechanic, thank you for the free master classes.
Ah what do you mean put the wheels on, I like to see you go down the road on the rotors at night and see the fireworks lol. Great job Bro. Oh is there a certain way you "bed the brakes"?
thanks 4 tips!
Man those Subaru engines sound terrible. Nice video!
I learned how to tell if a NAPA person is 1ying to me…I just look very closely at their mouths and and listen very carefully. If I hear anything coming out I know they're 1ying to me.